Backup/Restore function on firmware 4 vs process save/process restore on 3.7

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harpo
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Backup/Restore function on firmware 4 vs process save/process restore on 3.7

Post by harpo »

I am running a 7bbl production brewery utilizing one BCS-462 for fermentation control for three 30bbl fermenters, one 7bbl fermenter and one 30bbl brite. I have been on firmware 3.7.0 for the past 4 years. Before that, I still had the black case BSC-462 since we opened in 2012.

My question is, since I use the process save and process restore to upload BCS config files with all of the parameters set for each process to control fermentation based on the recipe of beer (different files for ales vs lagers, steam beer fermentation settings vs saison, different fermenters, etc) will I have to recreate the settings for each of those process files if I update to the newest firmware? My assumption is that there is a way to migrate these BCS config files to the new firmware, and we will just need to give it a shot. I just couldn't find specifics after searching. Most was on connectability.

I like having the ability to have the BCS config files stored on our "brewhouse computer" in the office where myself or my brewer can load the file for the specific beer we are fermenting without having to build the process each time. Will the process backup/restore on the new firmware function the same? I use web input buttons like some other users do and have been speed reading the forum that the new firmware doesn't support that function (I understand it streamlines the process and feel I grasp the purpose). We pride ourselves on very consistent beer each time, and the BCS plays a very vital role in that repeatability. It is also nice to be able to help other newer breweries using BCS as well with our BCS config files when they need a place to start, especially if they are new to the BCS and/or programming this stuff. That way there is a rapid learning curve that allows them to tweak what I give them to their wants, and then they know how to change things.

I realize that the new firmware is probably way easier to use, it is just that we have used 3.7.0 and predecessors for 5+ years now, 365 days a year, so changing to the new interface seems frightful because we aren't used to it.

Thanks.
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oakbarn
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Re: Backup/Restore function on firmware 4 vs process save/process restore on 3.7

Post by oakbarn »

The backup and restore are in a seperate utility. It is easy to "store"" recipes and that is exactly what I d for the different brews that I repeat.


The web buttons are removed but you can click on a State or Process to Kill or Assert. Same with the Outs. The Inputs are still a physical switch, but the Processes, States, and Outputs are all "web buttons".

You can migrate your processes and settings to the new 4.0.

The following is missing or changed in 4.0

1. No connect/disconnect Green/Red Radio buttons to let you know if you are still connected.
2. Apply Button gone. Your input is saved once you exit the field without any action on your part. If you made an error, you simply correct it. The ESC button does not work in this case as it does in some other programs.
3. Refresh Button is gone. See 2 above. The change is automatic. There are a few places where you must click a rename button to edit, but for the most part, you simply enter your new label.
4. Manual Mode is gone but the same functionality is there, just need to re learn the steps to do it.
5. “[+] HMI Builder” is gone. The is a USER (BBRALLEY) Built HMI that is available.
6. Digi16 Boards are not supported.
7. Out 6 and Out 7 are PWM on the BCS 462.
8. External PID Displays are renamed LEDs and you can now have all 8 Temperature Probes (BCS 462) displayed in LEDs.
9. If you change a Label, that is how you select it. For example, if you rename “Temp Probe 0” to “MLT”, you would always see “MLT” and there is no reference to Temp Probe 0 anywhere except on the Settings form.
10. For the most part, the F⁰ or C⁰ labels are gone in the “Process Editor” and the “Temperature Setpoint Adjustment”. They are still on the Temperature Gauges.
11. “[+]Configuration File Save/Restore” are moved to a Utility. It is best if you have an Internet Connection to Back Up or Restore. The file format has also changed. You should still not use commas in your labels, however. Additionally I would not use “,{,},[,}; (quote, curly brackets, square brackets, or semi colons in my name as they are used in the backup .json file. These may be allowed but I would avoid them if I could.
12. You are now able to migrate you Version 3.x backups to the BCS using the On Line Tool. If you do, be sure that it transferred correctly. Review all your processes.
13. There is a Recipe Utility Online.
14. There is a PID Tuning Utility Online.
15. Temperature Calibration is gone locally. There is a Temperature Tuner Online.
16. “[+]Miscellaneous System Settings” sub menu is gone. Most of the items are still available elsewhere.
a. Enable Authentication (Password Protection) CheckBox moved and renamed “Require Authentication “ under a new sub menu “Authentication” on the “Settings” Menu.
b. “Proc0 Force Run at Powerup” to “Proc7 Force Run at Powerup” renamed and moved to Process Editor as a Checkbox named “Run on Startup” on each Process.
c. “Manual Mode Force Run at Powerup” gone. Manual Mode no longer available.
d. “Disable Processes when entering Manual Mode ” gone. Manual Mode no longer available.
e. “Celsius Mode” Checkbox moved new sub menu to “General Settings” on the “Settings” Menu.
f. 50% PID Mode (Backward Compatibility) is gone
g. Active Outputs in Main Control Green CheckBox gone. Green is automatic.
h. Active Outputs in Main Control Red CheckBox gone. Green is automatic.
i. Force Alarm to Reg10 Checkbox moved and renamed “Alarm To Register 10 “ under a new sub menu “General Settings” on the “Settings” Menu.
j. “Email notification on Alarm CheckBox” moved and renamed “Send email on Alarm “on the “Process Editor” Menu. It is specific to a State and no longer a global setting. The PORT 25 issues remain.
k. “Average Temp0 and Temp1, place in Temp0 CheckBox” gone.
l. Use LED style temperature display CheckBox moved to a Pull Down Menu on the Main Control Panel and not labeled but has the selection displayed (Compact Style, Dial Style {Default} , LED Style).
m. Path to Alarm Sound. Default is '/alarm_clock.mp3' Data Input box gone. Looks like is '/alarm_clock.mp3' is all the alarm you can have.
n. “Header Text, System Name” Data Input Box moved and renamed “Name “ under a new sub menu “Device Settings & Info”on the “Settings” Menu.
o. “E Mail Address for Alerts” Data Input Box moved and renamed “E Mail Address “ under a new sub menu “General Settings” on the “Settings” Menu.
17. “[+] Communication Settings” sub Menu renamed “Networking” under the “Settings” Menu. A little different with a new built in Safe Guard to keep you from entering an IP Address by accident.
18. [+] Expand All and [-] Collaspe All gone on Menus. This is replaced by Toggle Text. Click on a “Heading” Greyed Out Text to expand, click on a “Heading” Black Text to collapse.
19. “[+]System Inputs and Outputs” Menu has been divided on the “Settings” menu into:
a. Temperature Probes
b. Discrete Inputs
c. Outputs
They generally are the same as 3.7.1
20. “[+] PID and Hysteresis Output Control Settings” has been renamed “PID Settings”. Generally the same as 3.7.1 but with the Out 6 and Out 7 added for the BCS 462.
21. “[+] Password Update” renamed “Authentication” on the “Settings” Menu.
22. No Longer to change the size of Temperature Gauges. You simply have 3 choices of style and not able to change the size within a style. See 16. l. above.
23. Process Logic Exit Diagram gone on the Main Control Panel. This has been replaced with a Process Display Panel. These can always be displayed on the Main Control Panel and you simply click on the State to ASSERT it. You cannot see any exit conditions, just the States. You may also have the Process displayed only when “Running” or “Never” besides “Always”.
24. Web Buttons are gone. You may simply click on a State to toggle it “On” or “Off” if it is displayed in the Process Display Panel.
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Re: Backup/Restore function on firmware 4 vs process save/process restore on 3.7

Post by JonW »

harpo - Yes, you can migrate your 3.7 configs to 4.0. Yes, you can save and restore those 4.x configs like you are doing now. However, there is additional functionality in the new firmware where you don't need to restore the whole config to the controller to update your different settings for each beer. There is now a "recipe utility" that allows you to just change the variables in your processes (times, temps). If your steps are very different for each beer, then you might want to still reload a complete config, but most usually don't go that way.

I think you'll find that missing WIN buttons is a non-issue. There only purpose was to jump to a new state and you can now see all states of your running process on the main screen, so you can jump to any state at any time - still a single button push.

Note that you can update to 4.x to play with it, then reload 3.7 if you're still not ready to make the jump. If you need any help with it, just give me a shout.
harpo
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Re: Backup/Restore function on firmware 4 vs process save/process restore on 3.7

Post by harpo »

Thanks both of you. Agreed on the WIN buttons. I get it now, I was just playing with someone elses brand new BCS to try and get a feel for it so when I tried to do my exit conditions and no web based inputs were there, I freaked out for a second. The other thing was being used to seeing the state setpoint temperature in the flow diagram from 3.7--I finally realized it was now the greyed out temp under the dial where the dial read actual.

Keeping things consistent is by far the best thing I love about this device--I look over each state every time I restore a process in 3.7 when I am getting ready to start fermenting a beer just to be sure something isn't awry. Having things in different order on the "edit processes" page on 4.0 just threw me a curve ball. Once I looked through everything it made more sense. Looks like I may make the move soon.
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Re: Backup/Restore function on firmware 4 vs process save/process restore on 3.7

Post by Brewtime »

1. No connect/disconnect Green/Red Radio buttons to let you know if you are still connected.

Well that suck I loose connectivity all the time
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Re: Backup/Restore function on firmware 4 vs process save/process restore on 3.7

Post by JonW »

Brewtime wrote:
Fri Mar 10, 2017 6:39 am
1. No connect/disconnect Green/Red Radio buttons to let you know if you are still connected.

Well that suck I loose connectivity all the time
Most people did not notice the color change of no connection. The 4.x firmware now has a prominent message displayed top center when you lose connection.

If I was losing connectivity all the time, I'd look for a more reliable method of networking.
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Re: Backup/Restore function on firmware 4 vs process save/process restore on 3.7

Post by brahn »

JonW wrote:
Fri Mar 10, 2017 8:36 am
Brewtime wrote:
Fri Mar 10, 2017 6:39 am
1. No connect/disconnect Green/Red Radio buttons to let you know if you are still connected.

Well that suck I loose connectivity all the time
Most people did not notice the color change of no connection. The 4.x firmware now has a prominent message displayed top center when you lose connection.

If I was losing connectivity all the time, I'd look for a more reliable method of networking.
The feature Jon mentions about a prominent message is not available in the 4.0.1 firmware. It will be in an upcoming release.

I agree regarding finding a more reliable method of networking.
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